Masterclass 8 - The Gift of Pain, with Tony R. Kitchens

If you can change your perspective on fear and pain, you can use them as fuel to create an amazing life.

Our guest this time was Tony R. Kitchens - author, entrepreneur and philanthropist.

This Revenue Coach® Masterclass was recorded live on Tue 28th February at 1200 UK.

Over 32 years, Tony has generated $110 million in revenue and serviced the world’s largest multinational corporations. Along the way he’s experienced highs and lows in both his personal life and business. Mental toughness can be the secret to a life of success - if you can turn pain into positivity.

Masterclass Transcript

Alastair Cole 0:08

Welcome to today's Masterclass from Revenue Coach. This session is being recorded live on LinkedIn, Twitter and YouTube. And it's being recorded for future viewing. I’m Alastair Cole, your host for the session, and co-founder and CEO of Revenue Coach - a SaaS coaching platform that demystifies the sales process for founders and accelerates startup growth. You can sign up for free at revenuecoach.ai and there's a link in the chat.

This is our eighth masterclass in a new series where we're exploring some of the biggest challenges in the workplace for sales professionals. And today's topic is the gift of pain. And our special guest is Tony Kitchens, author, entrepreneur, and philanthropist - who's coming live from Atlanta, Georgia, Tony has generated $110 million in revenue in servicing some of the world's largest corporations. He believes that mental toughness is the secret to life and success, and that we can all change our perspectives on fear, pain and challenges and use them as fuel to create amazing lives. Welcome, Tony!

Tony R. Kitchens 1:28

I appreciate it.

Alastair Cole 1:30

Having spent the last two or three years building businesses on my own, I've experienced quite a lot of pain, Tony pain of perceived failure, unquestionably rejection. And also in my personalised life in the last couple of years, you know, to pretty serious bereavements. You know, in the world of Sol Sol, it feels very, very real, very raw pain. What about you? What, what are the what are the biggest business pains that you've you've experienced in your career,

Tony R. Kitchens 2:07

there probably too many to count. But one thing that I would say, looking back, is creating businesses and being in a position where you don't have as much control as you believe you do. And I think coming to that realisation, and the effects of it, were very painful when you grow a successful company. And then outside factors harm you. Are you harmed by them, I should say. And there's nothing you can do to control that. I think that's a very sobering, very painful thing that a lot of founders, a lot of business owners face. And then the question is, can we even prepare for those things? Can we even build up systems and processes to alleviate potential pain when we face those things? I think that's probably one of the biggest ones.

Alastair Cole 3:05

Yeah, you I've heard you talk before about, about making sure that you prepare, making sure that your house is not prepared for pain, that one is putting the right things in place to stop that happening. And I guess turn it from something negative into something positive. How is that possible? What are the steps that people on this call should take to prepare themselves, you know, against feeling that pain?

Tony R. Kitchens 3:37

Yeah, I think, you know, one experience that I had in personal life, and in 2017, when I lived in Puerto Rico, that this massive hurricane, Hurricane Maria, that the eye of the storm went right over our house. 4000 people died that night, in the following weeks. It was a very devastating storm. When we first moved to the island, back about 11 years ago, one of the first things I did was to try to storm proof home because on any small island, there's always a potential for hurricanes. So I went out, got storm shutters installed on every window and every door, made sure that we had provisions and we had bottled water in storage. We had all of the supplies we needed: flashlights and extra batteries, etc. The generator, we prepared as much as we could, based on the situations that could happen on an island. And Allison, don't we do that in life, we should prepare as much as we can. For the environment, whether it's business or our personal lives. The thing that I learned after that storm was no matter how prepared I was, those outside forces that storm, the hurricane which had tornadoes in the middle of it, which was terrible. There was nothing that we could do to control that. However, we came out very well after that storm. Some of our neighbours were really devastated because they didn't put measures in place, they were more concerned with cosmetics. I don't want storm shutters on my windows, these are people that had means to be able to put measures in place. But there was an assumption there that it wouldn't happen to them. And if you take that example, and apply it to business and life, and you start looking at that, you say to yourself, I have to do as much as I physically can, whether it's sales, entrepreneurship and life, to prepare for uncertainty, but you can't control it from coming into your life. And I think that's the most important lesson we have to do as much as we can. While we have the energy and the resources, to provide a better solution, for the things that can come about, it takes a lot of determination. And it also takes a lot of creative thinking. Because we get so tied up in life, that many times we're just on autopilot, we wake up every day, we go through these routines. And we just assume if we get up the sun is going to come up, it doesn't always happen that way.

Alastair Cole 6:26

So I guess forewarned is forearmed. Right? people on this call listening live or watching it recorded back, you know, business professionals, sales professionals, what can what can what can a salesperson do practically like like your hurricane example? What can they what can they practically do in their in their working week in order to prevent those some of those classic painful things that happen to salespeople late missing targets, rejected by by would be sellers, what are the practical things people can do?

Tony R. Kitchens 6:58

I think the first thing is creating a mindset. And understanding that if you are an employee, your job is not as secure as you may believe. I think that's the first thing. If you're an entrepreneur, you probably are even more aware that your business is not as secure as you may want it to be. So if I'm a salesperson working for a corporation, the first thing that I would do is realise that it's a temporary position. It's temporary, until you miss your numbers and that company decides to make a change, and go in a different direction and doesn't include you or your sales team. With a type of team, I would understand that it's a temporary position. And as I did sell, and as I'm selling, I would really focus on saving as much money as I can for the inevitable. I've been around a lot of salespeople in life. And some of them are totally blindsided when they lose their jobs, as if they never imagined that that would happen. So the first thing I will say is be very conscious and aware that it's all temporary. The second thing I would do is also understand that it may not be the solution or service that you're providing today, that's going to get you to your ultimate goal. If you look at your dream, your goals, those are destinations, your company, your job as a salesperson is literally just a vehicle to get you to that destination. If we're so dedicated to the vehicle, we lose track of the destination or the goal. And that's one of the most devastating things you can do. So if you are in a position where you lose a job or you lose a client, as a business owner, it's not the end of the world. Because your goal is way more important than that one client, or way more important than that one job. So we have to really stay focused. But as far as salespeople are concerned, one understands that this is not a permanent position that you are in. The second thing is save as much money as you can for a rainy day. Because it rains on the just and the unjust. Meaning you could be an awesome salesperson, you can be an awesome salesperson. But if that company decides to go in a different direction, there's nothing you can do. And they want to pat you on the back and say thank you, good job, but you still have to go home to your spouse, or go home to your family and say I don't have a job anymore, I did everything that I could. Then the third thing is I would really consider whether what you're selling is something that you even care about, or is it just income for you or is it just revenue for you? And if it's not something that you truly believe in? You're not going to do very well. So I've seen salespeople, especially in the tech space, they really don't even understand it, they really don't like it, but they have good commissions. But ultimately, they don't last very long in this space. Because it's not something that they feel not just passionate about. But it's not even something that they really care about. I will look at it from a sales standpoint, is this just this again, really, when you really think about it, don't take any of this stuff too seriously. Meaning that, ultimately, the big corporations don't necessarily care about the people because they can replace them. But your job as an individual is to provide for yourself and your family. That may not include being at that same corporation tomorrow, or a year from now, same thing with business owners. Clients are fickle. And clients can blow in the wind in an unbelievable fashion. And we have to stand firm in what our goals are and not be swayed to start providing solutions that they want us to as one offs, as opposed to solutions that we know, moving forward are going to get us toward our goal.

Alastair Cole 11:19

Yeah, I mean, it makes sense as a continuation of the hurricane, you basically, you know, working on the principle that some things can suddenly go wrong, you might lose your job, you might miss the commission, you might lose that client. And so and so preparing for that, while also, I love that idea of, you know, continuing to shoot for that destination to make that progress and caring about what you sell, right, as a seller, obviously, that makes the job easier. Because you have a purpose, right? How do you do? How does that make the pain? Worse? If there's, if there's, if you're rejected, selling something you care about? Or? Or does it make it easier? Because you're, you're more aligned with what are your thoughts on that?

Tony R. Kitchens 12:08

Yeah, I mean, it's a great question, Alastair. And here's what I would say. No matter how tough you are, when you go to try to make a sale, and people don't buy from you, that's difficult. That's hard. Sometimes it can feel and be very personal. Especially if you're selling a service that you're delivering. It's very, it's a very difficult feeling. But here's the thing that I would say is, nothing in life is easy. And that pain from a rejection, as opposed to allowing it to cripple you, takes a step back. And understand that as much as it feels personal, it's not personal. It really isn't. It's just a situation where the person you're selling to either doesn't want that service today, well, that product, or they don't need it, or they don't have the budget for it. And that's not something that we have to take so personally, that we have to go sit in a corner and cry about it. I'll look at every single time I've been rejected in life. And you know, what it really does for me, is it makes me even more determined to get to that goal. Because if you have, especially if you have a financial goal, the thought is, you know what, I'm going to work even harder, because when I hit this financial goal that I have, I'm not going to have to worry about the rejection as much. Because again, I would have built up savings. Or I would be in a different financial position where I don't need every single customer, that potential customer that's in front of me. So I will look at it and say that the individual that rejected me, does not stop me from meeting my goal. But it is very personal, it feels personal. It definitely feels personal. But I just decided to take those situations and, and boil them up into a little piece of paper and burn them in use as fuel for this big fire that I have inside of me to continue. And to prove them wrong. You want to make sure the best is the best and not revenge. I don't like that word. But the best thing that you can do when you get rejected is to go out and get a sale to go out and get another win. So instead of focusing on that one, failure, that one missed opportunity, go out and get two or three more. And that will help move you past the pain. Because it's always better to have a win than it is to have a loss. But if we focus our time on the losses, we'll never get ahead. A friend of mine in Chicago, John Rogers, who owns Aereo Capital Management. Excellent, excellent firm. He always had this Same. And that same way people spend too much time admiring the problem. And we shouldn't admire the problem of fear, we shouldn't admire the challenge of failure, we should acknowledge it for what it is, and spend a majority of our time on the solutions, selling, getting past and reaching our goals and getting more sales.

Alastair Cole 15:31

You know, rings very true. For me as somebody who's in a lost account, not one business has been made redundant. These are these feelings at the time, they feel unbelievably personal. It's just about me, obviously, it wasn't right. They were about business, but they feel super personal. And I think that ability to move from, you know, from observing, admiring, observing the pain to start with, and then trying not to spend too long before moving into a positive phase and trying to sell more or how, what would be your tip? How can you obviously be the quicker one can do that the better? What would be your? How do you do that? How do you change? How do you turn it into a gift? How do you switch from it being a negative thing? How do you move quickly between those two phases? How could others do that?

Tony R. Kitchens 16:22

Absolutely. I'll allow myself to have the feelings that I have. That could be after you mentioned before losing people in your life, having business failures, personal challenges, I will allow myself as a human being, to very much feel what I feel, to feel the loss, to feel the sense of, of not hopelessness. But the sense of wow, this is reality, I thought that I was going to have that deal, we thought that the project was going to go through, but it did. And I allow myself to sit in that for a second, typically no more than a day. And that's very refreshing, because it makes you less robotic. But then what I do is, once you feel that pain, the next day, I'm all about moving forward, and trying to find a way to never experience that level of pain. Again, in the future. You can't form relationships, especially when you bury people who you love. But in business, you have an opportunity every single day, and sales every single day, you have a new opportunity to take that pain, and to use it as energy. For example, if you lose a deal today, the worst thing you can do is just sit around and complain about it. Because that momentum will stay with you for a few days, or maybe even a few weeks of sitting there doing nothing to change your circumstances. But if you allow yourself the next day, to make even more sales calls, to connect with even more prospective clients, just seek out a new client, as new relationships. Add that positive New Energy. After a couple of days, we want the energy that you'll forget about that loss, you're going to forget about that setback, because your mind has shifted. And when your mind shifts, your body will follow. If your mind is saying I'm going to win, I'm going to win, I'm going to make more calls, you're not going to be tired, you're not going to be worn out, you're not going to have low energy, you're going to be your body is going to be ready to move forward. Because here's the reality, if you face loss and sales, if you're not making your number, you're gonna wake up at three o'clock in the morning for one reason or the other. Then here's typically the two reasons that we wake up as entrepreneurs at two or three o'clock in the morning out of the pain of not making our numbers and not getting those deals. Or we wake up excited for the sun to rise so that we can focus on the new opportunities, no matter how I look at things in a different way. It's painful, it's more painful for me to not take action than it is to take action. I'll make 5060 calls no problem because I know that that's going to lead to a positive outcome. Whether it's today or a month from now. I can sit back at home in a corner and complain about the situation and here's the thing Allister that is not going to change anything is not going to change one thing and we have to avoid sitting in that pain and being paralysed by fear. Oh my goodness, I lost this one. If I make calls Tomorrow, I may have the same outcome. Well, you're absolutely right, you're going to have the same outcome if you don't do anything. But in sales and in business every single day, every single morning, this is probably one of the only industries that I know of, one of the only career fields or paths that I know of that every single day, you can wake up and literally, literally, change your future. It's a clear whiteboard. It's a clear sheet of paper every single morning, for you to go and have a very successful day, no matter what happened yesterday. And that's powerful. If you really buy into that notion that every single morning, you can control your destiny. If you decide to take massive action toward your goal, take three to five steps every day, make more calls, send more emails, you have absolute control over that. And that's powerful.

Alastair Cole 21:06

You've mentioned a couple times there, this concept of a day. And I think that's very powerful, isn't it? You know, you might have had a bad day yesterday, you felt some pain. Maybe you allow yourself a day to sit in that pain, like you talk about it. One day at a time, you had a shocker yesterday, tomorrow can be a better day, you know, and that is a beautiful thing about that 24 hour cycle. So that rings true for me as well, that, you know, we were talking before the call about that early morning, waking up that time in the morning, there was an opportunity when the day starts a new for a new focus. And I think that's a really interesting takeaway that, as I've heard you say repeatedly on other calls and other recordings, you know, if it's bad, this too shall pass tomorrow is a fresh start and a fresh opportunity to get going. I think that's a really powerful grounding message, the day is short and tomorrow can be different.

Tony R. Kitchens 22:06

And the add ons are that you're exactly right. And to add on to that, for you and I and anybody listening to think about this, when you've gone through a failure or extreme amount of pain with his work or personally, people are there for a very short period of time. Until it becomes a distraction from their own lives, their own goals. And if we don't make a change, and if we don't take action ourselves to improve our situations, nobody is going to be there to help you. Your friends and family love you. Your colleagues tolerate you. However, they have their own goals and dreams. They have their own responsibilities. And they can't be with us 100% of the time taking care of us. So where does that leave us? It's for you and I to make sure that we take action to make sure that we have a goal and a dream. And we take actions every day that lead to a plan. And a strategy for achieving those goals. Nobody's coming to help us as much as that sounds. I remember when I worked at IBM when I first interned after college, and the salespeople I was on the services team. But the salespeople who weren't making their numbers. Allaster, our manager Kate Budge, would make them come to the office at 7am on a Monday morning and talk about the plan for the week and how they were going to improve numbers. Oh, that's painful, to be up at 7am to go drive downtown Chicago and pay a lot of money to park just to avoid paying the other upset. I don't want to be in that position. So what did they do? They went above and beyond me, way more calls and way more visits. So they wouldn't have to endure the pain of sitting in an office as a grown person explaining it to another person, why they weren't achieving goals and their numbers. So a lot of times, we have to do what we have to do to avoid pain as well, not just to endure it. And I think that's the other thing, especially with sales, if you see another salesperson who's not making numbers. Or if you know another business that's struggling. One of the first things you want to do is you want to go in the opposite direction. You will say I don't want to deal with that pain. And you want to get up earlier, you want to stay up later at night making sure that you don't go through that level of pain that you witness. So there's pain we experience ourselves, where there is also pain and we are witnesses to and in both cases. It takes action from us to do better. To strive for more.

Alastair Cole 25:06

Yeah, if I It feels like the that sales director, the sales manager talking about in Chicago that she was almost also helping them build that early morning habits, you know, though, those those habits that you should be, you know, avoiding that pain and and also that if you know things aren't going well then she's doing for them maybe what they ought to have been doing for themselves getting up early getting on the phone early, chasing those deals.

Tony R. Kitchens 25:39

Yeah. And another thing that it did it taught me, and I think this alludes back to a previous question you had was some of those reps, I think most of them eventually wind up changing careers. And I think they discovered that they weren't as passionate about some of the technology, as the other people were, for whatever reason. And they wound up leaving that company, it was a pretty big company to have left that company, they remained in sales. But if I remember correctly, they sold vastly different things than technology. And maybe that's where they should have been in the beginning. Maybe.

Alastair Cole 26:19

And for those people who you know, may be on the right track, but that they're struggling. You what what kind of impact have you seen coaching have for for salespeople who may be missing targets and trying to avoid pain,

Tony R. Kitchens 26:38

A phenomenal amount of help has I seen when people get coached or mentored. And I think the reason is, is, especially with coaching, because a good coach is going to axe thought provoking questions. They're going to bring out the person that they're coaching, they want to bring out ideas, and they're going to bring out actionable items that that person is telling them that they're going to do and they're going to take to improve their situation. And that's extremely powerful. I think the other thing, however, with coaching and mentors, is that it's really about ultimately it's about why you're doing what you're doing. And the more important you are, the more likely you are to succeed. Because if you have a y like taking care of your family, putting kids through college, then you're going to work pretty hard because it's not about you. It's not just about the commission and buying a vehicle and things of that nature a nice suit. But now you have responsibilities in your inlining your work ethic with those responsibilities and you will be amazed Allister to salespeople were amazed when you realign your actions every day, to a higher purpose other than just vanity sake, which is mind more things, that you're going to work way harder, because now you also don't want to disappoint the people you love. And love is the most powerful fuel you can ever have behind that probably a good second place is pain, pain is going to motivate you to a certain point, to not experience that level of pain again. But coaching is so important to get an outsider to come in clear through the noise that we have inside of ourselves about why we're not performing, how we should realign our goals in our strategy to get to accomplish those goals.

Alastair Cole 28:47

Here Thank you, QA time is almost almost coming to an end. And I think some of the things that jumped out for me were were your hurricane analogy and effectively us getting ready for pain assume that you are going to miss that deal that you might get, you know made redundant so to keep that in the back of your mind that preparation I think is key. I loved your idea of things being temporary, both allowing yourself to be in pain for a while for a day, but that is temporary and tomorrow's another day and that will pass. Trying not to take things personally. It's so hard, but cracking on with the cause. And I think ultimately for me, the thing that's come through is just to keep going towards your goals your destination key working in that direction and that will ensure that if pain comes it'll it'll be less you know and that you if you care about those goals genuinely whether that's kids through college or the software you're selling or whatever that is I think keeping going. Keeping driving towards your destination is the big thing that I'll take out to try and keep that pain away. So that's, you know, been some cracking insights. Tony, thank you very much. anybody who'd like to follow up with you or learn more about what you do as a specialist, coach, and in this area, how can we get in touch with you?

Tony R. Kitchens 30:19

Absolutely, they can hit my website, Tony, our kitchens.com. And from there, there are social links at the bottom. And there is also an opportunity for a contact button. And I do Alistair, this is going to be surprising. But I do respond to email and phone calls, which is probably a lost art with US business.

Alastair Cole 30:42

Well, I hope not. And if anybody Yeah, and I think the link URL for your website is in the chat now. And if anybody watching live or watching back on recording wants to know more about how a revenue coach demystifies the sales process and accelerates growth, they can head over to revenue coach.ai. And there is the product, you can follow the QR code and the URL. So really, all that's left for me to do is to thank Tony for catching our fantastic guests. Thank you for your time and your insights, Tony.

Tony R. Kitchens 31:23

Thank you very much, Addison, I really appreciate it. And for anybody who's listening, remember this. If you have a destination you're trying to get to, and you're driving a car and it breaks down. You can take a bus, if the bus is not going your way. You can catch a plane. If you're really determined and you have to be there you can walk. And the moral of that is don't quit whatever job or career or business whoever today is simply a vehicle to drive you to a different destination. Focus on that destination and you will get there by any means you will be there for sure.

Alastair Cole 32:00

Brilliant. Well, thank you, Tony. Thanks for being our expert in this session. And we'll call it we'll leave it there. Thank you very much and goodbye, everybody.